What services can we offer from 1st July 2020?

When is your ETA @chris ? Is this proving problematic in a way you hadn’t anticipated?

This is realistic imo. My view of the most important use case is to support collaboartive work in teams (‘circles’ even!) with persistent shared workspace and persistent shared documents.

I don’t see ad hoc meetings, each starting from scratch, with presenters bringing their own package of materials in their briefcase, as basically the most significant use case.

These are zoom rooms and we are about one year and perhaps $200k away from technically and operationally able to support that as a service. Ballparking.

To clarify . . does Organization = container x3, ie the resellers’ service bundle? In which case, name it “Resale”?

From the table, Organization looks kinda like “Supersize” - a Large org with very large meetings. Is this really a use case? Isn’t this beginning to be “Event”?

Could pricing be added to the table @benhylau - interpolated from the original, even if rough. This will be a helpful start point for tomorrow’s discussion. Broadly, I like the divisions.

No, it’s a single container where you are prohibited from resale according to:

The main thing Organization allows is for admins to have their own single Greenlight container and register as many accounts as they like for their own org members. This is not same as reselling.

Events will be very similar to Organization currently, but over time it will be backed by more BBB server resources.

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Glad this is on the roadmap. Room-open for 24hr is a good initial step. Let’s not call 'em zoom rooms though :wink:. Branding! “Circle rooms” may fit the culture we mean to enable?

It’s not necessarily on the roadmap yet, I am just mentioning that as a concept in zoom and thinking about their infra to enable that, the software and infra that we don’t have, and the labour behind making that as a service. Roughly $200k for MVP.

Uh huh. So . . an Operational Organisation Member is permitted to resell. The terms being . .

  • They get two containers: Small, Large; and
  • They commit a percentage of resale revenue, and keep open accounts?

But not all OOMs will necessarily re-sell? An OOM might just, say, commit operational labour to meet.coop?

Yes that’s correct, based on last All Hands meeting the feedback that I got.

Proposal v3

Free Small Large Organization Custom
User accounts 1 1 1 Unlimited Unlimited
Max rooms per account 1 5 10 Unlimited Unlimited
Max meeting duration 1h 24h 24h 24h Unlimited
Max meeting participants 5 20 40 100 200+1
Recording
Customization
Server Shared Shared Shared Shared Dedicated
Event server access2
Setup cost3 0 10€ 10€ 100€ 200€
Monthly cost3 0 15€ 40€ 100€ Custom
Comparable Collocall.de 0 17€ 42€ 93€ 200€
Comparable Zoom.us 0 - 14€ (1 host, 100 participants) - 190€ (10 hosts 300 participants)

1 BigBlueButton recommends that no single session exceed 100 users
2 Event server is available to Members for a time duration for a fee and has specs matching an Organization tier at the moment with unlimited rooms, but we aim to move that to a dedicated server cluster eventually
3 Prices are exclusive of applicable sales tax

This is from a long chat discussion with @hng @mikemh and the limits now reflect the realities of the tech we have and pricing compatible with collocall.de and comparisons with zoom.us.

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Personally and just checking it briefly this looks good to me.

Just a note: For now we at collocall also limit the Organization account to 50 participants. But in general I have the feeling that most customers have a higher number of possible participants in mind than they actually need/use, so these numbers may just be numbers :wink:

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But didn’t you say above that:

So, in effect everything over 10 users is actually unlimited? (even if we state otherwise?)

I was talking about two different things: The maximum number of rooms a user can create in Greenlight (1,5,10 und 15+/unlimited) and the maximum number of participants in one room. Hope this makes it clear?

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Thanks, yes, that is clearer. A less tired me might’ve even worked that out myself! :stuck_out_tongue:

How about we try to keep things very simple and offer just three options:

  1. Free account, which would be on a separate container, demo.meet.coop and have strict limits on the number of rooms, number of participants and meeting duration.
  2. Paid account, which would be on a separate container, (perhaps meet.coop / www.meet.coop ?) and would have high limits on the number of rooms, number of participants and meeting duration. The price of a paid account could depend on the number of accounts an organisation wants, for example €20 for one, €80 for five, €160 for ten.
  3. Container, dedicated container on a custom domain name, unlimited accounts managed by the owner of the domain name, €200+ a month depending on settings.

My thinking being that migrating people who want to change their account service level between containers would be an absolute nightmare and also that there will be organisations that want a few accounts with shared rooms.

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Does this get rid of the concept of reselling, and all account types are now centrally managed (creation and admin) by the Technology Operations circle?

Another way I am thinking about this is we are merging Small and Large into a single tier, which has always been a cost-per-account anyways, but with “volume discounts” (e.g. how you said “€80 for five” not €100). I think it’s a good idea, and we can adjust limits according to our available resources on that share container.

Are you still concerned about centralizing the setting up of accounts being a ton of work? Perhaps we can just have the Product Strategy and Services circle handle that?

@chris maybe you can fill this table so we know what that looks like before the Tues meeting?

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keep it simple yes, let’s look at the details.

and the demo container would give access to the same BBB production server or to the other one? I’m afraid of the current demo giving a bad UX as several people have reported so far.

One container could do for the “central” onboarding service at least, where the Product/Service Circle takes care of user accounts. Especially if we follow the logic you suggested during last All Hands Meeting, where we do keep different service levels, that approximate costs and make up affordable prices that people can choose from according to their needs & abilities
The fact of having more accounts per organisation doesn’t necessarily equate with more usage costs than 1 account shared by 1 org. The limit of max participants does do that, i.e. having max 20 or max 50 participants does mean more server impact generally. And even though in the beginning we can’t have the various limits segmented in one container, we could over time implement that, IMHO. Don’t you think?

that’s the collocall option for 250 participants. I’d be more in favour of the 100 ppl max participants for 100€, as that might match more the user needs/abilities IMHO.

If we can iron out these kind of details, we can indeed keep it simple. I wonder how the reselling would look like :slight_smile:

cheers,
Wouter

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It would be nice if @hng @chris @wouter @osb can all attend tmr’s service level call and we settle this once and for all as Product Strategy and Services Circle, then bring it to Thurs for approval :smiley: Can all of you attend tomorrow’s 3 pm CEST call?

If this impacts how we view “reseller” we can also propose necessary amendments to the membership page.

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Now I recall that I cannot make it that late tomorrow unfortunately. Would it be possible to be meeting earlier? I have the morning until 13:30 CEST or could do between 14:30 and 15:30 CEST. I’m sorry that my timeframes are somewhat limited.

i should be able to do those times… let us know what time is confirmed…?